‘Porn And The Pandemic’ Book Review Podcast Series Episode No. 1

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In today’s podcast, I am joined again by Joshua Shea, the author of, ‘I am a porn addict and now what?’. In this episode, we discuss his latest book, ‘Porn And The Pandemic’ which looks at how three months in 2020 changed the culture around porn. So welcome to another episode of podcast series episode No. 1 Book Review: Porn And The Pandemic.

Below is a non verbal transcript for the same

[Music]
hi
this is arun from ironsyoga.com
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you could connect with me in irons
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here i am helping you to design a divine
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understanding
[Music]
hello all today’s podcast i am joining
with joshua shea
again he is the author of the book i’m
upon addict
an award in that this episode we are
discussing about his book
pond and pandemic which talks about
how three months intended today
changed the culture around porn however
welcome to another episode of podcast
series episode number one
book review porn and pandemic
so hi joshua this is iron again um i’m
so happy to see you again to
my podcast so this time i am i would
really like to
talk about your book called the porn and
the pandemic
what is that actually happening during
the time of pandemic
and why people’s are going to porn
and more specifically like
this book giving actually uh
a glimpse that an idea that there is
something called
porn addiction is actually existing
so there is something called the healthy
pond upon uh
viewers and there is something called
the addicted
uh pawn viewers so
this book gives an idea about who is
spawn at it and who is not
would you like to talk a little bit more
about that
like um there is some data are presented
in this particular book and
there is more things are there inside
this particular book
uh even though this is a very small book
it gives a very pretty good idea about
what is actually happening can you
just describe um exactly what is that
porn addiction is and uh
what is that the healthy porn viewers
yeah absolutely uh well um first of all
it’s important for everybody to
recognize
that addiction is addiction as addiction
as addiction is addiction
if you have an addiction to alcohol or
you have an addiction to
sex or food or heroin
or pornography or whatever it is
uh from from one person to another
most of what’s going on in the brain is
the same addiction is
a uh disease of the brain that’s
important
people to realize it’s not uh you know
if you’re addicted to food it’s not an
addiction of the stomach
if you’re addicted to gambling it’s not
an addiction of the wallet
every kind of addiction is addiction of
in the mind
so uh we each happen to fi those of us
who
are addicts or former addicts and like
we discussed before i
am both a former porn addict and a
former alcoholic
i have i have found
that there is no healthy level
of alcohol or pornography that i can
have
that is because something in my mind the
disease
of addiction in my mind makes me crave
these two things
to the point that it has very negative
ramifications on my life
that’s what addiction largely is it is
when you cannot stay away
from a substance or a behavior
despite understanding that there are
very negative consequences that could
happen
it’s also when you take this substance
or behavior
and prioritize it in h ahead of things
such as your health or your
relationships with your family and
friends
or your safety or your money
the number one thing in your life
becomes the addiction
and finally for for somebody who is an
addict and is looking to identify it
uh most addicts can tell you very long
stories about how they have made
uh promises to themselves how they have
made
bargains with themselves that they won’t
use
whether it’s i won’t drink tonight or i
won’t look at porn tonight
or i’m not going to go online and gamble
and play poker tonight
and they fail at keeping these promises
that’s another big sign of addiction
so when it comes to you know pornography
obviously
i can’t look at pornography because it
has very negative ramifications in my
life
now we can talk about pornography and we
can talk about
whether it is ethical to look at
pornography or whether
it’s morally wrong to look at
pornography i think that’s a completely
different discussion than what we’re
having here
right now if we want to talk about you
know what’s
what’s right and wrong because that’s
different for every person
and in recognizing that’s different for
every person
i think that we have to scientifically
accept the fact
that there are people who can look at
pornography
who can use it in a i don’t want to
necessarily say healthy way
but can use it in a way that is not
unhealthy
this is similar to me who can go to a
casino
twice a year or three times a year and i
can
win a hundred or lose a hundred it
doesn’t matter to me
i i i don’t crave going there
i don’t have a problem overeating i
don’t have a problem
under eating so i’m not afraid to go to
restaurants or buffets or anything like
that
that’s because my behavior in those
areas
would be considered healthy and there
are others who can be
healthy with pornography i just think
that
it’s it’s one of these things that
we don’t talk about much in this world
because it involves sex
because it involves nudity because it
involves
you know our private sexual thoughts
we don’t discuss it very much and i
think that
based on the internet coming into our
houses over the last 20 years
that we do need to talk about this
because for the first time in
you know civilization two million years
that we’ve been around or whatever it is
we now have unending access to any kind
of pornography that we want
and we don’t know if that has an effect
on us
we haven’t studied it over the long term
and it’s important that uh
people understand that uh yes
while there can be healthy sexuality
just like i think i
am a healthy gambler i’m a healthy eater
it’s good to know what it is you’re
dealing with you know i understand
there’s gambling addiction
i understand what people who are
gambling addicts think
and how they act if i ever saw any of
those behaviors in
me or any kinds of red flags i would
stop gambling immediately
so all i ask is people who can handle
pornography
who are not like me who are not addicts
all i ask is that you understand
that there can be too much pornography
there can be an overuse of it
and you absolutely need to uh
be aware that that’s possible and if you
are aware
and it’s not happening to you go ahead
it’s it’s
if pornography is part of your healthy
sexuality
it’s and it’s legal i i’m not going to
be the one to stand in your way and say
no
so and uh here in this particular book
you are giving a lot of data like
many peoples are coming to um
many websites like onlyfans.com
and some other uh particular website
where
people become like
online strippers um they sell their
uh stripping tendency i mean
whatever we can see on bars or anything
like that they are
selling it through online and
um is this data what you are describing
in your book is actually accurate those
many peoples are
are there so many peoples are coming to
online stripping club oh yeah and i
actually have
more data since that book was uh
published
um because we have many many more months
of data
since uh that that book was put out
there
and on january 1st to show you how
how much the online uh explosion
of do it yourself make it at home
pornography
was there was about 300
000 people who were making pornography
for only fans on january 1st

  1. now on january
    on january 1st 2021
    there was approximately 1.3 to 1.5
    million people
    making it online and that
    means that just on that one site across
    the world a million people in one year
    joined the world of making online
    pornography
    and that’s only one site you know there
    are plenty of campsites there are plenty
    of other options out there aside
    from only fans if you’re going to do
    this kind of thing
    and
    that to me is probably going to be
    the uh legacy of the pandemic
    because a lot of these people across the
    world
    they were put out of jobs and who were
    put out of jobs the people who worked at
    restaurants
    the people who were bartenders you know
    your waitresses your
    the people who worked in public service
    jobs who are those people
    usually they’re usually young people
    they’re usually people who are
    good looking they’re usually people who
    are
    able to um be good with customer service
    so suddenly these people can’t pay for
    their rent
    they can’t pay for you know their food
    or if they have kids or
    how do you suddenly support you know
    your life
    when overnight this pandemic hits the
    world
    and you have no money what do you do
    well
    in this case a lot of men and a lot of
    women decided to start taking pictures
    of themselves
    and start making videos of themselves
    you know either
    you know in their underwear or naked or
    having sex or
    or whatever they determined was suitable
    for them
    and started selling it online and
    because
    there were so many of us at home who
    couldn’t go to work anyway
    because you know non-essential workers
    or whatever you call them depending on
    where you live
    the use of pornography skyrocketed so
    while obviously you know it’s important
    that people get vaccines and wear masks
    and all this all this stuff that’s very
    important for right now
    i think 20 years from now we may be
    talking about
    the pandemic uh in the in a way that
    talks about
    how it changed pornography online
    because
    people who had never considered looking
    at pornography online
    ran to it during the epidemic watched it
    like they’d never watched before during
    the
    epidemic or i’m sorry pandemic and
    not just that but millions of people or
    at least one million people
    who had never made pornography and sold
    it before started doing that
    technically if you are selling your
    pornography
    you’re a professional you’re a porn star
    so
    right now and as you and i record this
    in the middle of 2021
    we have more porn stars out there than
    we’ve ever had in the history of the
    world
    and i don’t know if that’s a good thing
    i don’t know if that’s a bad thing i
    mean i i think in the long run it
    probably isn’t good
    um because a lot of these people who are
    doing
    who are making the pornography may not
    understand what the ramifications are
    down the road they may not realize that
    not only
    you know uh do you have nude pictures of
    you out there forever
    but maybe there’s maybe there’s a mental
    toll maybe there’s people who
    uh who get addicted to making the
    pornography when i was writing my book
    i spoke with many only fans models
    and while many of them were doing it for
    the money during the pandemic
    a lot of them started telling me things
    like you know i just uh
    i feel so special when i’m doing this
    people make me feel good
    i can’t get a boyfriend in real life but
    i’ve got men who want to fly me around
    the world and give me vacations
    and i think that for a lot of these
    people
    this may be the kind of escape that
    drugs provide some people that alcohol
    provides some people
    as strange as it sounds to many of us
    i think that creating pornography
    is an addiction for many of these people
    they speak about it the way that
    people speak about the dopamine rush of
    other addictions
    so i wonder in 20 years are these men
    and women who are 25 years old now
    are they going to be 45 years old and
    still putting pornography on the
    internet
    not because they’re making money but
    because it’s that addiction it’s that
    dopamine rush
    i think that this coronavirus pandemic
    will be remembered as the time that
    people making pornography first showed
    signs of addictions
    not just people like me who had been
    looking at it for 20 years
    so you already wrote a book about this
    pandemic and how it’s
    so there is not a conclusion this is
    something which i felt by reading your
    book
    you are not concluding that how it’s
    gonna
    affect the human relationship how it’s
    gonna
    uh take up on our further sexuality of
    the peoples those who are gonna watch
    this particular kind of
    bone and when these models or
    the strippers the those who comes out
    how do they gonna
    face the society on there is is there
    any conclusion
    like um is there any conclusion you
    would like to give like
    i think it’s too early to have a
    conclusion i mean you you know me well
    enough
    that i like data
    i like uh research i like scientific
    conclusions
    and i don’t think that enough time i
    mean we are still
    hopefully dealing with the tail end of
    the of the pandemic right now hopefully
    it’s almost over but
    who knows a year ago we were having this
    conversation hoping that it was almost
    over back then
    so we don’t know where we are in the in
    the active world of this pandemic right
    now
    um so i don’t think we have enough data
    i don’t think that we
    i think that statistics that i give
    people
    about pornography before the pandemic
    are absolutely useless now
    because we’ve all had our lives changed
    so much in 2020 and 2021
    because of this pandemic i mean most
    people
    while people like you and i who do
    podcasts
    uh we’ve known about zoom for a long
    time the rest of the world didn’t know
    about
    zoom before the pandemic the rest of the
    world had never had a meeting or a
    doctor’s appointment
    over the computer before there were you
    know most a lot of people had never
    done curbside takeout for food before
    all of these things that are new to our
    lives are probably going to stick around
    how is that going to affect you know
    restaurants how is that going to affect
    the economy
    how is how is our new life
    after uh the coronavirus you know after
    coven
    how are our new lives going to be we
    don’t know
    that yet so i don’t think we can reach
    a final uh conclusion about what
    happened with pornography during the
    pandemic yet
    because we’re at the tail end of the
    pandemic all we know
    based on looking at website statistics
    of
    many of the larger uh pornography sites
    is that it’s undeniable that more people
    looked than ever before
    and more people were making it than ever
    before i think that’s
    for some of these people there may be
    side effects that don’t show up for
    years
    there may be you know a 22 year old girl
    who you know for three or four months
    made made content for one of these sites
    or was a cam girl
    and then she stopped now what happens in
    10 years
    if you know she has an eight-year-old
    kid and they come home from school and
    say mommy
    you know tommy or johnny’s father said
    that you know you were on the internet
    with no clothes
    how does she deal with it then who knows
    what happens
    what happens if uh you know forget that
    what happens if in 10 years
    all of a sudden she starts getting
    massive depression
    what if she becomes religious or or has
    a change of heart
    and believes what she did was very very
    bad
    and slips into a depression you know we
    don’t
    know how these people are going to react
    10 years later 20 years later to having
    this very personal sexual content out
    there
    we don’t know how it’s going to affect
    their lives now i’m not saying we need
    to wait 20 years to
    find out but i think that we just don’t
    have enough
    data now to really understand what
    normal
    is all i can say is that i think
    that the new normal involves a lot more
    people watching pornography than ever
    before
    and a lot more people making pornography
    than ever before
    what does that world look like i guess
    we’ll find out together
    so is there any message like i felt like
    there is a lack of
    message in uh the work which you have
    done over here
    like uh this is not giving any message
    like um
    it is actually giving hints like on
    those who are not
    aware of many of these website they will
    be
    after reading this particular book they
    will be aware of that particular
    websites and they will be start using
    that
    uh i don’t know whether it is a positive
    effect or negative effect or
    is this what something which you have
    thought to put out
    for the public or something like that
    but there is a lack of message inside
    this
    so what is that your vision like what is
    that your vision
    what you want to say these are data
    like collection of data and data from
    different websites including pornhub and
    its videos and many many other websites
    out there
    uh many datas um so
    what is that you would like to say what
    is that message
    yeah well as you know i’ve written three
    books that’s that’s my most recent book
    and all of them are very different my
    first book was my personal
    story um of addiction my second book
    was designed for the partners of people
    who were porn addicts
    this book i actually tried to go more
    back
    i was a journalist and a newspaper
    writer for about 20 years
    i wanted to create something
    that was less emotional and
    and honestly had less of a message what
    i wanted to do
    was to present data that was fresh
    and to give people a true picture
    without
    without taking an opinion on it you know
    is pornography good or bad
    we can discuss both of those things is
    it okay to go
    online and and sell pictures of yourself
    naked well maybe for some people it’s
    okay
    maybe for some people it’s very harmful
    the the direction i took with this book
    was to try to not um
    sway somebody’s opinion i wanted to
    present them with data
    based on where we were because let’s be
    honest this pandemic they keep saying is
    once in a hundred years
    this is something that our parents and
    grandparents
    never experienced so um
    what i wanted to do was almost just take
    a picture if you look at a picture
    there’s no opinions in a picture there’s
    not usually a message in a picture
    you have to look at it and you have to
    interpret it for yourself
    and that’s what i wanted to do with this
    book was to present the data and say
    here is what is happening right now
    here is how this is different than
    before the pandemic
    is this okay is this good
    is this bad is this horrible do we need
    to decide
    as a society that we have to fight this
    online
    pornography and people making it or do
    we need to all
    lighten up and say this is just part of
    our world now
    like everything else and sexuality is
    normal so
    we need to just not worry about online
    pornography
    i didn’t want to have my personal
    opinion
    affect too much of this book so i’m
    actually glad you noticed that because
    it’s by design
    if there was a message my message again
    is
    education here are a lot of facts
    you have to interpret these facts for
    your
    personal life and your personal way of
    being
    you know i can pick up a book of
    cocktail recipes
    and i can make mixed drinks for people
    all day long
    i just can’t drink it because i know who
    i
    am i can’t drink alcohol i can be around
    it but i can’t drink it
    and that’s kind of one of these things
    where i think
    people need to look at their own use of
    pornography
    or look at their own creation of
    pornography
    and then consider the facts in that book
    and make their own decision whether it’s
    healthy for them or not
    and if they should change anything in
    their life or not based on the data that
    i present
    so for instance somebody who is actually
    don’t
    know about this and somebody
    for example let’s assume there is a
    normal person
    and uh he is very religious person and
    there is the one porn star who does
    phone
    for a living recurring time
    okay and these two peoples assume that
    these two peoples are reading this
    particular book
    and um my question is
    what is the change you want to see
    on the mind of these two people
    i want them to
    [Music]
    have new facts that they haven’t had
    before
    i want them to learn i want them to
    learn what the numbers look like
    i want them to learn how they have
    changed
    i want them to look at their own lives
    and then factor in this data
    and determine you know i believe that
    this book
    when i talk about the average person
    looks at
    this website for pornography for 12
    minutes
    and i do go through uh different adult
    websites and talk about how their use
    was a little bit more like you know one
    website went from the average user went
    from nine minutes to 12 minutes
    well if you’re somebody who’s reading
    this book
    and you were looking at this website for
    30 minutes before the pandemic
    and during the pandemic you started
    looking at for four
    hours that should probably tell you that
    compared to the average person
    you’re looking at this a lot more is
    that a problem
    you know is it a problem if you uh are
    looking at pornography far more than the
    average person
    it may not you may not even know what
    the average person
    looks at pornography but in this book
    these facts and figures are there
    and you can compare your life in your
    individual situation
    both whoops excuse me both before the
    pandemic
    and during and determine if any use
    before
    or during or increase of use during is
    unhealthy for you and with somebody so
    that’s what i would say to the person
    you see okay
    all right and and for the second half of
    that question for the person who is
    making pornography
    i don’t know if they think about the
    long term
    of it and i’m not saying that i don’t
    think it’s going to be a big deal if you
    have naked photos out in 20 years
    because millions of people will have
    them out there i don’t think
    that we will view nudity as the taboo
    uh we view it as now in 20 or 25 years
    but i also think we have to ask the
    question
    is that healthy and hopefully some of
    these people who perhaps are making
    pornography
    and look at the book we’ll stop and
    think about things in a way they haven’t
    before
    you know if i am i doing this just for
    the money you know
    i told myself that i was going to
    uh make only fans for
    just during the first six months of the
    pandemic before i could go to work
    well now a lot of these people are
    deciding to stay with only fans
    and not go to work so what’s uh
    what’s what’s the best what’s the best
    thing for them to do
    they are now changing their plans are
    they changing it because of the money
    or are they changing it because they
    love the response from people
    they love the attention they crave you
    know people telling them
    that they’re handsome or beautiful so i
    think that
    uh it’s important for the the people who
    are
    making it to uh
    to stop and think um
    what is going through my mind what are
    my motivations for doing this
    you know i started this to make money
    that was my honest truth i started this
    to make money
    but we’re now a year later i could go
    back to work
    but i’m still doing this why am i doing
    it
    really what i’m hoping that giving
    people data does
    is force them to look at their life and
    ask themselves some hard questions and
    you know
    they are the ones who can come up with
    the answer with them even when i’m
    coaching people
    you know i have to tell them i’m not
    here to give you answers
    i’m here to just ask questions i’m here
    to provide some facts and some data
    you have to apply the data you have to
    apply these questions
    to your life and make your own decisions
    so in this particular book there is an
    incident which you were speaking about
    that your son was actually recording
    um what was that happening like
    you were the while developing the
    content for this particular book
    you were speaking about the content of
    this particular book
    and your son was recording that
    to make the content of this particular
    book so
    in that particular time what was that
    happening through your mind
    how do you look at on that particular
    taboo subject
    how do you look at into that particular
    taboo subject like father is talking
    about the bone
    and the sun is recording the same i
    think
    that what we have to do is to
    step back from the idea of father
    son mother daughter i think that we have
    to
    i mean obviously they’re important
    things their relations and all that
    but what i think we have to do is
    remember that each one of us
    individually is our own unique sexual
    being
    now here’s the reality is i don’t want
    to think about my
    parents ever having sex that’s gross but
    the reality is my parents had sex one
    day
    i’m proof um and and they had they had
    sex twice because i have a brother too
    my guess is they probably had sex a few
    other times too and
    that’s not something that’s a bad thing
    that’s not something that’s
    that that should be a taboo thing no i
    i’m not i’m not
    saying in that way no no i understand i
    understand but what i’m saying
    what i’m getting to is that i also have
    to accept the fact
    as a father that my 22 year old daughter
    who has lived with a guy for several
    years
    of course she’s having sex with him and
    i have to accept the fact that my 18
    year
    old son who is going off to college in a
    few weeks
    he is probably going to go off to
    college and have
    sexual experiences i think that and
    i think that what we have to do is step
    back
    from these father son mother or daughter
    all of
    these relationships that we have in our
    head and what they mean
    and i think we have to look at ourselves
    just as humans
    and what’s taboo for one person isn’t
    always taboo for another
    although i mean there are society taboos
    but we have to respect the fact that
    we’re each
    different sexually and yes your kids
    may not have the same opinions of sex
    may not have the same behaviors towards
    sex that you do
    that doesn’t make them a bad person
    whatsoever that just makes them a
    different person
    so you know your taboos may not be their
    taboos
    their taboos may not be your taboos we
    have to respect each other i think
    that’s
    that’s at the core of it is that we have
    to absolutely respect each other
    as different sexual beings and i think
    that if we see something happening
    that doesn’t look healthy we should
    speak up it’s like if you know if all of
    a sudden i notice that you’re losing a
    lot of weight
    and you’re not eating i should say
    something because i
    i wonder if your nutrition is healthy
    you know if all of a sudden you start
    sleeping
    six hours extra every day than you have
    been
    i should probably speak up and say
    something it doesn’t matter if you’re my
    friend
    my wife my son you know we need to look
    out for each other and we need to exp
    respect that we’re all different
    individuals
    even if we have these family relations
    that sometimes makes talking about this
    stuff taboo
    so one more question um
    this book approximately cost 10 to 15
    usd right approximately 15 years yeah i
    think it’s uh it depends
    sometimes amazon runs uh sales
    uh but the the kindle version is around
    10
    and then i’ve seen i’ve seen the paper
    one that you have anywhere from five to
    ten
    depending on if they’re running a sale
    so
    is that what spending
    what do you i don’t understand the
    question so if somebody wanna spend
    approximately 10 to 15 usd to this
    particular book
    uh is this really
    worth that guy to pay for that how do
    you feel about it
    well i i think it’s worth the money uh
    of course because i wrote it uh i don’t
    want people to read it
    and think that it’s going to solve their
    pornography problem
    because it’s not it is it is more like
    journalism it’s a it’s
    it’s more documentary than anything else
    if you
    you know read my first book if you are a
    porn addict and you want help
    read my second book if you’re married to
    a porn addict
    or you’re dating a porn addict and you
    want help this
    third book is looking at how porn
    addiction
    exploded or potentially will explode
    because of the pandemic uh this is the
    this is
    this book is the least amount of
    self-help of anyone i’ve written um
    what i’m trying to do here is just
    document a moment in time
    so you know obviously i think it’s i
    think it’s worth it i wouldn’t have
    spent the time writing it if if i didn’t
    think that it was worth it
    i think it’s an interesting story and i
    think now that we
    are 18 19 months into this pandemic
    i think that people can look back and
    recognize oh yes i remember early on
    we were all stuck at home i bet most
    people who read the book are like ah yes
    i looked at pornography more than i did
    before
    i think that it will my hope is that
    this book even in 10 years
    there will be students at university
    writing papers about the pandemic
    and they will use this book as a
    resource
    uh documenting what was happening at the
    time
    i look at this book as more of a
    historic document
    if you don’t have a pornography problem
    if you’re not that interested in
    pornography addiction
    you may still like this book if you
    enjoy history
    or you enjoy non-fiction it is a very
    different book than the first two so i
    don’t want people
    to mistakenly get it and think that it’s
    going to fix their porn problems
    it won’t that’s why i wrote my first two
    books this was just kind of a different
    project
    so uh how many days did it took to write
    this particular book
    oh that was this was a crazy crazy
    project
    uh most my first two books the first one
    took me
    two years to write two two and a half
    years to write uh the second book took
    about a year and a half
    um this book i
    pitched it to my publisher on may 1st
    and by the middle of july it was
    published
    i literally spent probably
    30 days in a row working 18 to 20 hour
    days
    interviewing people writing getting data
    because i knew i needed this book to
    come out during the pandemic
    so people could look at their behavior
    and look at the facts
    and adjust it if they needed to um so
    it’s
    this was a crazy crazy project it was it
    was almost too fast
    for for my comfortability level like
    to go from two years writing a book to
    not even
    two months um that’s that’s crazy
    but it was very long days lots of
    interviews lots of writing
    lots of data uh but i’m very proud of it
    i think that for the time i had to write
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it
for getting it out as quickly as i
wanted to it needed to
um it’s it’s not a bad book
so so the same thing will happen
actually like um
you know we were saying that for for an
example
of pawn stars kid and
he is actually complaining to his mummy
that he found out
her in uh in an adult film
so uh and your grandkids your kids and
grandkids are coming to you
and saying that hey look at this you
were upon addict
so how do you actually respond to that
particular situation
well my what i would do is it depends on
their age
number one and it depends on how much
they already know about pornography
and if they know what pornography is do
i have to explain pornography to them
and how old are they you explain
pornography to a five-year-old
it’s pictures of people who are naked
you know
versus somebody who’s 12 years old who’s
probably already seen pornography on
their own
um you know that’s that’s there’s a
there’s a world out there where people
will pay to see
you know naked people and i had to make
money once
and i decided that i would let people
take pictures of me naked
i was over 18 years old so i could make
my own decisions
and i knew that someday people might see
it and who maybe i didn’t want them to
see it
and i certainly didn’t want you to see
this but
um i did what i needed to do to make
money
uh and i am either ashamed of it and it
was a mistake
because of a b and c or i’m proud of
what i did and it was not a mistake
because of a b and c and if you want to
do this kind of stuff
i hope you’ll talk to me first and i can
tell you more about it
but you cannot do it until you’re 18
years old
and you can make your decision on your
own until then
this stuff is off limits just like
cigarettes or drinking
or you know depending on where you are
in the world and your your age
limitations
uh you know like marijuana or whatever
this is off limits to you until you’re
18 years old
once you’re an adult you’re going to be
able to make your own decisions because
you’re going to understand
uh more of the issues around this um so
i i i wouldn’t treat it like it’s a
giant taboo i wouldn’t if you know if i
had a
you know grandkid or i had a kid come up
to me and be like oh look what i
oh my goodness put that down oh my god
no that’s horrible
yet you can’t have that reaction because
it immediately oh there’s something
special about this
if you don’t want this to be special in
the kids mind
you can’t act like it’s a big deal
whether they’re 6 years old or 12 years
old
i don’t think you can act like it’s a
giant deal
because i think that creates more
curiosity
you know oh my god what if dad or if
grandfather uh cares so much about this
what’s the big deal
he doesn’t care about very many things
but he clearly cares about this
so i think that if you can be like yes
these are pictures of naked people
some people like to look at these some
people will pay money to look at these
some people have jobs where they let
people take pictures of them like this
you shouldn’t let people take pictures
of you like this and you can’t take
you can never take pictures of other
people like this this is for grown-ups
this is for adults
and if you see this somewhere you know
let me know
i’m not going to be mad at you or
anything i just want to know how you
stumbled upon it
uh much like if you find a cigarette
you know on a playground don’t put it in
your mouth or if you find an open bottle
of beer
don’t take a sip this is something
that’s just for adults
and i think being that simple with it i
think being that
calm and collected with it will go a lot
further than if you act like it’s a very
big deal
so did your book does your book
had enough reach as much as that you are
thinking
uh how do you mean that i can take that
a couple different ways
[Music]
so what is that the reach that you are
imagining
on your mind uh this book i
i think yeah i think that there’s going
to be a life for
it right now uh with people who are very
interested in the pandemic and just
everything around it
um and people who are worried
about their porn use because of the
pandemic i think if people were porn
addicts
back in 2010 this book won’t do much for
them
i think that if people you know uh
if their porn behavior is largely the
same as it was before the pandemic
it’s it’s probably it’s interesting but
it doesn’t affect them very much
i think the people whose behavior has
changed
this gives them data to measure their
changing behavior against
i think that’s who it’s really for right
now
once we get past this pandemic once we
get into
some kind of routine of whatever
normal life is going to be after the
pandemic
i think that’s when more people may look
at this this book
for historic reasons and for the data
they may not use it to
measure themselves because in real time
we’ll be past the pandemic at that point
so i’m hoping it lives on
as a historical document showing what
was happening
at this one snapshot in time
so hopefully people who uh
come back to look at the pandemic come
back to look at human behavior
sociology sexuality during the pandemic
we’ll see this book as a resource for
years to come
that’s that’s my hope at least
so what is the market says like let’s
put it in a business terms like what is
the markets is that you are imagining
this book has to go to
i think that my hope is that if there
are uh therapists if there
are rehabilitation centers if there are
doctors
who are dealing with uh
patients and clients who report
uh that their sexual health
is has declined during the pandemic for
whatever reason
you know especially pornography that
they can
give them this book or they can
recommend this book
um as something to read
to figure out where they really are you
know here is
the average person went from looking at
this pornography website
from nine minutes to 12 minutes during
the pandemic
you say that you look at this website
too you were looking at
you used to look at it for about 20
minutes now you’re looking at it for 30.
well you look at it more than the
average person but that’s not a
ridiculous amount of information that’s
not a ridiculous increase
you know from 9 to 12 minutes 20 to 30
it’s it’s it’s a little bit similar if
you if you uh
extrapolate it however if you used to
look for an
hour and now you’re looking for five
hours like i mentioned before
that’s not what the regular person is
doing that’s not what the average person
is doing
i think more than me saying hey you
should be careful here or more than
you’re the doctor saying
hey you should be careful here you know
there are a lot of people who want to
deny that they have a problem who don’t
want to believe they have a problem
who who truly don’t believe they have a
problem
for myself who’s a very scientific
logical guy
i think that if i was given this book
during the pandemic and my pornography
use increased
i could look at it with no judgment with
no opinion
because it’s just data people you know
people looked at it with these numbers
this is what the numbers of people
making pornography were it’s it’s so
it’s a book
of a lot of numbers um and i do talk
about how numbers can be manipulated so
people have to keep that in mind
but it’s a book of numbers that
can help you gauge where you are it’s
it’s like the the gas
tank in your car and the gas gauge you
know if you don’t know what that means
on the car it’s not going to matter to
you whatsoever
i’m trying to teach people when it comes
to pornography
you can use this book as a gauge to
determine whether you
are full of problems or you are
completely empty of problems
just like your automobile is is full of
of of gasoline and fuel
or it’s completely empty of gasoline and
fuel
it’s it’s not an opinion how much fuel
is in your car
it’s a fact it’s a mathematical
measurement
and i wanted to put mathematical
measurements in this
book because i know that there are a lot
of people
who don’t like advice don’t like
therapists
don’t want someone to step in and tell
them how they should live their life
so if i just give you data if i just
give you the numbers
you can make the decision for yourself
if you’re using it in a healthy way
or if you’re not using it in a healthy
way if your behavior
changed during the pandemic did it
change
on into an unhealthy thing or was it
just like everybody else so
all i’m trying to do is give people
facts
and i’m trying to help other people
who help people if that makes sense i
think this is a book that you could give
people coming into a rehab center and
say here here’s an easy book to read
your first week here
it just talks about what’s been
happening with pornography lately
you know a doctor can be like here you
talk you told me about your pornography
use just read this book and see if it
means anything to you
and i think that there are people who
this book can
get a message to um but it’s so
individual
that’s why i didn’t want to make it i
didn’t want to make a message there
it’s up to you to decide if you’re an
addict it’s up to you to decide if you
use something in a harmful way
it’s up to you to decide what you need
to do moving forward
maybe the answer is you looked at
pornography in a healthy way before the
pandemic maybe you look at pornography
in a healthy way
during the pandemic maybe there’s
nothing wrong
with what’s going on with you and
you needed some kind of data to tell you
well here it is
so i think it’s a book that can be used
by just about anybody who deals with
other people
in the world of pornography addiction
so is there anything i have actually
completed everything which i
want to discuss with you like do you
wanna uh add something on the top of
this well all i wanna say
is that you know no matter what your
behavior is
during the pandemic or before the
pandemic
it can always change and it’s important
to understand
if your behavior is uh healthy or not
most of us understand what it means to
you know drink
alcohol in a recreational safe way
and we understand what it means to be an
alcoholic who can’t do that
what we need to understand as a society
is what does it mean to look at
pornography
in a recreational healthy way and what
does it mean to be one of those people
who is sick or who has the the brain
disease of addiction and i think
that needs to be with no judgment
whatsoever that needs to be something
the average person knows
the average person knows how to see a
drunk to see an alcoholic
we need the average person to be able to
know how to
see and recognize porn addiction maybe
not in somebody else
but at least in themselves and hopefully
this book will be a step forward towards
that
uh so one thing how many copies has been
sold out so far
uh it’s been out for just under a year
and the last time that i got
a report from my publisher was in may
and i believe it has sold something like
600 or 700 copies at this point
so are you happy with that
i’d always like more my second book says
my my first book
has sold a little over a thousand copies
and i’m cool with that uh this book like
i said has sold between six and seven
hundred copies
by the time it’s as old as my first book
it’ll probably be back up there
uh obviously i’m not getting rich off
any of that when you factor
all the time it took to write those
books and and
uh the fact that i only get between one
and two dollars per book sold
you know i’m not even making you know
minimum wage i’m making horrible money
writing these books
uh but that’s not the reason i write
them now my second book
my second book that was designed for
partners has sold
thousands and thousands of copies and
i’ve
made some money off that book and that’s
nice and that book has
uh exposed me to a lot more people than
either of the other books i wish they
would all sell very well
but i didn’t write this book to to
you know get rich i wrote this book to
just
use my skills of journalism to share a
story that i saw happening in front of
me
that i knew nobody else was going to do
because all the scientists are busy
trying to
solve this problem you know the writers
of the world are
writing other stories about the pandemic
i knew that
it would be good for me to document
both as somebody who’s an expert in
pornography addiction
and somebody who used to be a journalist
it was important to me to create
some kind of document that says hey
here’s where we are
right now and maybe this book
will be you know maybe this book will be
a revelation in 20 years to people
and there’s some piece of information in
there that will be hugely important in
20 years
i don’t know but i didn’t write it for
the money
i wrote it uh to
to try to get the people who read it to
think about their use and you know what
um now there’s you know 600 or 700 more
people
thinking about it and hey that’s good
that’s maybe some of those people won’t
go down the road that i
did maybe some of those people won’t
become addicts maybe some of those
people
will feel freer to talk to people about
pornography
i’ve got you know i wouldn’t be doing
this show with you right now if it
wasn’t for that book
so it’s not just about the money it’s
about how much i can get out there now
however many people listen to this show
they would not have heard this message
had i not written this book
and that’s one of those things that you
know it just extrapolates
maybe somebody who’s listening right now
maybe they’ll become a client of mine in
coaching when i coach
porn addicts well then gee i guess
writing that book
which got me on your show which got me
this client is a good thing so
it’s it’s hard to measure exactly when
it comes to money
no i’m not making much money on this
book at all but
i’m helping people and maybe it will
lead to other things
and maybe it will lead to helping more
people and to me that’s a win
yeah so yeah
we have done uh almost everything
i thank you for joining me uh for
today’s podcast uh
so hopefully we could actually do uh a
podcast
the book the one of the best-selling
book of you like the
yeah which is for the uh couples how
does it’s for the couple
for example most of the couples are
actually seeing uh
i mean they are also getting into the um
online uh sexual
violation or behavior or some some porn
is like uh
so much is like uh violation of the many
people’s actually
uh uh it’s actually a spoil their
uh what innocence towards the
sexuality like the wild thoughts as you
have
already spoken in the first podcast like
the
uh nowadays the women don’t want to have
uh
sex love to make love with the um
virgin boys they want somebody who is
already lost
right because uh you know they all
become violent
towards the sexuality yeah absolutely
yeah
absolutely this book will be like the
book for the
um couples should be
um i think it’s
something is there if you feel we can
actually do something
yeah i would i would i would love to
talk about that one um very much and
the one piece of the little the one
statistic i’ll give you
about couples um that’s very very
interesting
is that uh here in america um
couples who start their relationship
or start their marriage not looking at
pornography
but then add pornography viewing to
spice things up
or to add some excitement uh after they
get married
they end up divorced three times more
than people who were already looking at
pornography at the beginning of their
marriage
or people who never looked at
pornography during their marriage
which to me is it’s fascinating i don’t
know why that is
i don’t know i don’t think it’s a direct
correlation but the fact that people who
add pornography viewing to their
marriage
divorce three times more than people who
don’t
or people who are already looking that’s
pretty fascinating to me
yeah i so basically i
have i have people who are actually
talking um
these things like astrology things in
india and
peoples who are actually comes from west
also if you look at on my
podcast series actually i am having
podcast with the
indian peoples also and the podcast with
the um
western people so also so the uh one
important thing is like
most of the people from the west
actually got divorced
uh one or two times in their life they
are
trying to seek a relief or something why
it is happening will they get into a
relationship
soon or the relationship which they are
having right now
is gonna stay with them for uh some time
or what is it
so but that is one thing and uh um
when we are speaking in hindu indian
people
but what they say is that is there
anything to
reduce the uh
house problem like uh you know the
assault sexual assault or violations
which is happening right
inside the home how can we come out from
that this is what they are
asked there is no no solution for they
they are not actually um
in uh they are not actually
in entertaining an idea of
idea of getting divorced again and again
and they’re just
going on things like that so
i can see those things um yeah however
and also the uh phone which is coming uh
from the west is actually largely
consumed if you look at on the data
the uh countries like india and all the
largest consumers of the
pornography online internet pornography
and how does the behavioral changes are
going to happen because the
most of the people uh uh on online is
not from
uh india or whatever because maybe of
the uh
now it’s actually uh changing like
people’s are getting into technology and
stuff like that and
i have no idea how it’s gonna actually
this is
the fact because people’s comes to me
clients comes to me they speak about all
these things
so i can understand what is that
actually but i don’t
i don’t have any conclusion why it is
like
because i i don’t know how to conclude
this thing
because internet made us a global uh
thing like everything is everywhere
well i was gonna say we love to we love
to uh as
as as human people we love to wrap
things up like a tv show we love to have
neat conclusions
we love to package things up and say
here’s the problem here’s the answer
but that’s not the way life works
and you know it’s just one giant ongoing
story
that was happening long before you and i
were here and it will happen long after
you and i are gone it’s just
it’s one long story yeah it’s evolution
probably i don’t know yeah so
let’s have a talk on your
the title of the book is he’s a porn
addict
now what so that is for the couples
that is for the couples and the partners
okay okay now you are going to send me a
copy of that
yes i will i will i promise i
okay will uh so yeah let’s
catch up sometime at the time all right
it was great talking to aaron yeah bye
bye now
[Music]
thank you for listening to my podcast
you could connect with me in irons
yoga.ion where you could
see my contact details including my
phone number
my whatsapp and email id stay tuned for
more
exciting episodes
[Music]
it’s

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